The only damage Mr. Moran’s post may have done is do to the right’s incredibly efficient spin machine and the left’s lack of solid ground. No sentient observer could deny the hatred that oozes out of both trump and miller.
Funny, no one is attempting to rebut the truth of Moran's post. What he said is so true and perceptive that all of Trump's defenders can do is call him names and say this reveals the bias of the media. No one, especially not Miller, can deny that hate is the element he and his boss swim in. It was indeed impolitic for Moran to speak so plainly; only Trump and his minions are allowed to characterize their opponents as haters, Marxists, communists, etc.
I do not think Moran should be reprimanded. Fox news always gives their opinions as news all the time. So why should Moran be treated differently? The standards of neutral reporting has long since passed with entire newspapers geared to their ideologies and TV news sane washing Trump. Free speech needs to be just that. We are in a new era, there the old neutrality rules no longer apply. This should be no different, especially where the president himself is trying to control the narrative!
I’m generally againt heading to the gutter with the excuse of they do it already. But I do think we need to call out what kind of “qualification” current policy makers have for what they do and name what aims it serves. So naming Miller as a hater seems more in bounds than not. But if he were merely censured for intemperate language (in a context in which most criticism is demonstrably too temperate) I’d be ok with that choice. But does anyone actually think this is likely?
The administration and its enablers’ currency is censorship with a purpose: to mislead the masses and quell dissent. Anyone who speaks truth to power will be sidelined in corporate media - no matter how nicely they say it, the end result will be the same. Silence dissent.
I’m sorry, but as someone who has worked in journalism in the past, you, like many of your colleagues are living in a fantasy world of journalistic objectivity and both-sidism that no longer sadly exists. I applaud Moran for his bravery - as an experienced, well-trained journalist to make a comment like that, you know things are really bad in this country. So at this point you do the right thing and stand up to defend our country and its Democratic principles against Trump and his MAGA anti-American authoritarian traitors or you end up in the very wrong side of history.
Impartiality gives fascists equal footing and has not been tradition of US press since Paine. A dictator who weaponizes lies and intentionally misleads to stoke fear, anger and violence needs to be highlighted, just as it was in our Declaration of Independence.
I agree. In times past, journalists shared traditional American core values: truth, justice, an equal playing field for all, the right to safety, free speech, prosperity, etc.
That's why right wingers love to claim the media has a leftist bias: they hated that journalists reported from values that contradicted the right wing's values of power, wealth, privilege, etc.
So the right wing worked hard, for decades, to make values-based reporting obsolete. They neutered the media so well that journalists now report as if there's no such thing as right and wrong, cruelty and compassion, hate and love. "Just the facts, ma'am, is all we've got. It's up to you to decide what matters in this crazy, mixed-up world."
But here's the problem with reporting as though nothing is good and nothing is bad: when a nation's free press fails to ground its reporting in healthy, humane core values that create stability and strength, it creates a sick, inhumane nation that's unstable and weak.
The contrast here is what's important. Trump propagandists (they are not journalists) at Murdoch properties do not play by rules -- journalistic, moral or otherwise. Real journalists like Moran do and must. But in doing so, they mute their descriptions of the depravity of the people now in power and the depth of the crisis we face. I believe journalists can put a finer point on the anti-democratic actions of this administration without sacrificing standards.
There is no restraint on the language coming from the 'reporters' at Fox, OAN, etc -- The scales are tipped when only one side adheres to norms and a contrived neutrality. To achieve parity, and knowing the Murdoch mouthpieces are no-holds-barred, we need to meet the moment with equal vociferousness and clarity. When the NYTimes calls the Kilmar Abrego Garcia abduction a 'mistaken deportation' --this late in the game, that's a disservice to readers. That's an editorial decision. We know the refusal to respond to a supreme court decision is a deliberate one. And these, any of these, deportations is not a 'mistake'. It is a strategy.. a dragnet; much larger than the innocent-sounding, forgiving tenor of a 'mistaken deportation'.
I've noted the "mistaken" in various news stories. Totally agree with you, it was illegal and should be reported on as such. The people doing the detaining certainly don't think they made a mistake.
But if you can see thru their baloney, what makes you think they can't see thru yours? Not only won't you gain anything, you'll have lost the moral high ground
I fear the Rubicon was crossed when Trump was re-elected. The MSM is almost irrelevant at this point. People have chosen their preferred narrative. Murdoch has conditioned his tv audience (made up of mostly folks less dedicated to critical thinking than these times call for) to believe that America is dealing with an invasion. The WSJ has played fast and loose with its editorial page for decades. Reporters should report and not analyze or editorialize and yet when only “one side” plays by the rules…..
In the Rightwing press it is Calvin ball (thank you Bill Waterson) and has been for a LONG time.
Exactly this! When in a sea of hateful and UNTRUTHFUL rhetoric, to call a spade a spade becomes necessary. As a former journalist, I understand the taboo and the difficulty of crossing that line. I think the nuance here is that Moran used an adjective. If he had said “Miller is motivated by hate and animus”, it would have actually remained objective.
It’s but a nuance. And it is the kind of nuance that draws criticism no matter what: on one hand people will say that it’s not “objective” enough and on the other hand those same people will criticize the “left” for being too woke and squabbling over meaningless distinctions. Guys, y’all have an autocrat in power who is escalating things and has a number of propaganda machines at his disposal and a public that has been taught to NOT think critically.
I have tremendous respect for Moran- because no matter what, the controversy around his tweet got the job done. People see it. Will it change anything? Who knows. It won’t change MAGA’s mind.
This is worth watching for the paychology and philosophy behind why Trump and his lackeys remain popular: https://youtu.be/HAo2bGWyGlU
I’m old school enough to think Moran should have kept that opinion to himself, and I’m new school enough to believe he could have expressed it in a different, truthful way without crossing the line.
Journalism is changing, moving toward advocacy, which doesn’t bother me. People expect it. Is it gray? Absolutely.
It's been advocacy reporting for a long time at fox, OAN, Newmax, even the Wall Street journal but the traditional press tries to play it straight so democrats are left fighting with one hand tied behind their back.
I agree but only to an extent. The traditional press engages in far too much bothsidesism and not enough objective truth. The best examples are shown by the many ways the NYT tried to extract some possible somewhat sane approaches out of the word salads espoused by Trump on the campaign trail, whereas an objective approach would have required the NYT to simply state that virtually nothing that Trump said made any sense whatsoever and, for the most part, was not expressed coherently. Trying, instead, to make sense out of the nonsensical is not playing it straight.
The mainstream “liberal” media also causes a lot of damage by playing along with the right’s fear mongering by hyping or even exaggerating negative news and a burying good news. The way they report you would never know that crimes levels have been a record low levels for quite awhile, with a bump up during covid that quickly subsided. We did have a serious violent crime problem in the 80s and 90s that began dropping throughout the 90s and has stayed low. The late Kevin Drum made a strong case that this drop was due to countries getting lead out of their environments, mainly by phasing out leaded gasoline. That sharp drop in crime is a story the MSM has deliberately ignored. For example the number of murders in NYC last year was 377; in 1990 there were 2, 245 murder and the population was less than it is today yet the mainstream media gives the impression that NYC is a crime ridden city. They also conveniently overlook the higher crime rates in red state cities and rural areas.
The media spent last year hyping any negative economic news and ignoring or downplaying the fact that inflation in the US was returning to normal levels, we had strong growth, the best job market in over 50 year, record employment for African American men, and wages rising faster than inflation with the greatest gains going to the lowest income levels. Not bad for an old senile president. A solid majority of swing voters who went for Trump told pollsters that they believed the national economy was bad/in a recession. They also told pollsters that they and their regions were doing well economically. Our founding fathers knew that a democracy requires well informed voters. The media doesn’t seem to see that as their responsibility despite the fact the Founders gave them special constitutional protection. They seem to believe their job is to cater to the feelings of the “real Americans” in MAGA land.
I think Moran's opinion is absolutely borne out by the content of Stephen Miller's tweets and therefore constitutes factual reporting. As I said above, I agree with Margaret on the principle but think that this particular case is not the hill to die on.
Moran spoke the truth. We constantly hear the lies in the Wall Street Journal and the New York Post & on Fox ‘news.’ I prefer honest reporting. I’ll make up my mind. It’s time to shock the right with the truth. It appears ABC feels somewhat the same because they did not fire him. Funny, the bully always says it’s ’ not nice.’ I recognize your journalistic concern. But we are at war here. Do you want ABC to mince words on what’s happening in LA?
Does anyone remember how Hitler rose to power ? Does anyone care ? The freedom of the press, meaning the owners of the papers , did not let their journalists/ employees speak freely.
Moran does not deserve a reprimand. I appreciate old school reporting objectivity, but I'm more offended by reporters plainly ignoring the facts of character, which are clear in both Miller and Trump.
I despise Rupert Murdoch and the damage he has done to the accountability of the media and journalism. Because of him and President Reagan there are no consequences for lying to the public and therefore we get agenda-driven “news”. He is directly responsible for the nightmare of Donald Trump and the misinformation he spews from Fox and other networks! Murdoch can go straight to hell!
This is what’s wrong with the democrats. We’re too nice! Moran did a great job handling that fool we are forced to call our president. He’s a straight shooter without a gun. Why is he being punished! Disgusting 🤢
Silly me, I always thought journalism was about truth and integrity, and THANK YOU Terry Moran for having the courage to display both. His comments about Stephen Miller can be supported by facts and evidence, unlike Millers opinions about immigrants and people of color. Media needs to follow his example, but of course won’t, better to let the current state of affairs to continue to metastasize.
The only damage Mr. Moran’s post may have done is do to the right’s incredibly efficient spin machine and the left’s lack of solid ground. No sentient observer could deny the hatred that oozes out of both trump and miller.
There are a lot of people in this country who are brainwashed and far from sentient
Funny, no one is attempting to rebut the truth of Moran's post. What he said is so true and perceptive that all of Trump's defenders can do is call him names and say this reveals the bias of the media. No one, especially not Miller, can deny that hate is the element he and his boss swim in. It was indeed impolitic for Moran to speak so plainly; only Trump and his minions are allowed to characterize their opponents as haters, Marxists, communists, etc.
I do not think Moran should be reprimanded. Fox news always gives their opinions as news all the time. So why should Moran be treated differently? The standards of neutral reporting has long since passed with entire newspapers geared to their ideologies and TV news sane washing Trump. Free speech needs to be just that. We are in a new era, there the old neutrality rules no longer apply. This should be no different, especially where the president himself is trying to control the narrative!
I’m generally againt heading to the gutter with the excuse of they do it already. But I do think we need to call out what kind of “qualification” current policy makers have for what they do and name what aims it serves. So naming Miller as a hater seems more in bounds than not. But if he were merely censured for intemperate language (in a context in which most criticism is demonstrably too temperate) I’d be ok with that choice. But does anyone actually think this is likely?
The administration and its enablers’ currency is censorship with a purpose: to mislead the masses and quell dissent. Anyone who speaks truth to power will be sidelined in corporate media - no matter how nicely they say it, the end result will be the same. Silence dissent.
I’m sorry, but as someone who has worked in journalism in the past, you, like many of your colleagues are living in a fantasy world of journalistic objectivity and both-sidism that no longer sadly exists. I applaud Moran for his bravery - as an experienced, well-trained journalist to make a comment like that, you know things are really bad in this country. So at this point you do the right thing and stand up to defend our country and its Democratic principles against Trump and his MAGA anti-American authoritarian traitors or you end up in the very wrong side of history.
As Amanpour states, “truthful, not neutral”. If people are being rounded up in front of a public library or families held in a basement https://www.cbsnews.com/news/immigrants-at-ice-check-ins-detained-and-held-in-basement-of-federal-building-in-los-angeles/ it requires a type of coverage that explains inhumane treatment. Otherwise the public normalizes intentional infliction of violence. Images are important component to connect history and pluralism of our country.
Impartiality gives fascists equal footing and has not been tradition of US press since Paine. A dictator who weaponizes lies and intentionally misleads to stoke fear, anger and violence needs to be highlighted, just as it was in our Declaration of Independence.
I agree. In times past, journalists shared traditional American core values: truth, justice, an equal playing field for all, the right to safety, free speech, prosperity, etc.
That's why right wingers love to claim the media has a leftist bias: they hated that journalists reported from values that contradicted the right wing's values of power, wealth, privilege, etc.
So the right wing worked hard, for decades, to make values-based reporting obsolete. They neutered the media so well that journalists now report as if there's no such thing as right and wrong, cruelty and compassion, hate and love. "Just the facts, ma'am, is all we've got. It's up to you to decide what matters in this crazy, mixed-up world."
But here's the problem with reporting as though nothing is good and nothing is bad: when a nation's free press fails to ground its reporting in healthy, humane core values that create stability and strength, it creates a sick, inhumane nation that's unstable and weak.
The contrast here is what's important. Trump propagandists (they are not journalists) at Murdoch properties do not play by rules -- journalistic, moral or otherwise. Real journalists like Moran do and must. But in doing so, they mute their descriptions of the depravity of the people now in power and the depth of the crisis we face. I believe journalists can put a finer point on the anti-democratic actions of this administration without sacrificing standards.
Hear, hear. Murdoch journalists might well get innocent people killed in L.A. Let's keep our eye on THAT ball, shall we?
There is no restraint on the language coming from the 'reporters' at Fox, OAN, etc -- The scales are tipped when only one side adheres to norms and a contrived neutrality. To achieve parity, and knowing the Murdoch mouthpieces are no-holds-barred, we need to meet the moment with equal vociferousness and clarity. When the NYTimes calls the Kilmar Abrego Garcia abduction a 'mistaken deportation' --this late in the game, that's a disservice to readers. That's an editorial decision. We know the refusal to respond to a supreme court decision is a deliberate one. And these, any of these, deportations is not a 'mistake'. It is a strategy.. a dragnet; much larger than the innocent-sounding, forgiving tenor of a 'mistaken deportation'.
I've noted the "mistaken" in various news stories. Totally agree with you, it was illegal and should be reported on as such. The people doing the detaining certainly don't think they made a mistake.
I'm with y'all. It was done on purpose and I want to scream when I see it excused. It seems to be everywhere.
Indeed. Call a kidnapping a kidnapping. If Biden had Trump picked up and sent to El Salvador, would the NYT have called it a mistaken deportation?
Now I'm wishing Biden HAD shipped Trump off to El Salvador...
Maybe. I wouldn't put it past them.
"To achieve parity... we need to meet the moment" No. Two wrongs don't make a right.
Then we surrender. This is not 1990's --even 2000's politics. This is different and its 'for keeps'.
So you adopt the despicable behavior of the other side? Not following
No, I equip my side so we are equally armed
But if you can see thru their baloney, what makes you think they can't see thru yours? Not only won't you gain anything, you'll have lost the moral high ground
Having the moral high ground in conflict with Trump is of little or no value. Trump certainly doesn't care.
I fear the Rubicon was crossed when Trump was re-elected. The MSM is almost irrelevant at this point. People have chosen their preferred narrative. Murdoch has conditioned his tv audience (made up of mostly folks less dedicated to critical thinking than these times call for) to believe that America is dealing with an invasion. The WSJ has played fast and loose with its editorial page for decades. Reporters should report and not analyze or editorialize and yet when only “one side” plays by the rules…..
In the Rightwing press it is Calvin ball (thank you Bill Waterson) and has been for a LONG time.
Exactly this! When in a sea of hateful and UNTRUTHFUL rhetoric, to call a spade a spade becomes necessary. As a former journalist, I understand the taboo and the difficulty of crossing that line. I think the nuance here is that Moran used an adjective. If he had said “Miller is motivated by hate and animus”, it would have actually remained objective.
It’s but a nuance. And it is the kind of nuance that draws criticism no matter what: on one hand people will say that it’s not “objective” enough and on the other hand those same people will criticize the “left” for being too woke and squabbling over meaningless distinctions. Guys, y’all have an autocrat in power who is escalating things and has a number of propaganda machines at his disposal and a public that has been taught to NOT think critically.
I have tremendous respect for Moran- because no matter what, the controversy around his tweet got the job done. People see it. Will it change anything? Who knows. It won’t change MAGA’s mind.
This is worth watching for the paychology and philosophy behind why Trump and his lackeys remain popular: https://youtu.be/HAo2bGWyGlU
I’m old school enough to think Moran should have kept that opinion to himself, and I’m new school enough to believe he could have expressed it in a different, truthful way without crossing the line.
Journalism is changing, moving toward advocacy, which doesn’t bother me. People expect it. Is it gray? Absolutely.
It's been advocacy reporting for a long time at fox, OAN, Newmax, even the Wall Street journal but the traditional press tries to play it straight so democrats are left fighting with one hand tied behind their back.
I agree but only to an extent. The traditional press engages in far too much bothsidesism and not enough objective truth. The best examples are shown by the many ways the NYT tried to extract some possible somewhat sane approaches out of the word salads espoused by Trump on the campaign trail, whereas an objective approach would have required the NYT to simply state that virtually nothing that Trump said made any sense whatsoever and, for the most part, was not expressed coherently. Trying, instead, to make sense out of the nonsensical is not playing it straight.
The mainstream “liberal” media also causes a lot of damage by playing along with the right’s fear mongering by hyping or even exaggerating negative news and a burying good news. The way they report you would never know that crimes levels have been a record low levels for quite awhile, with a bump up during covid that quickly subsided. We did have a serious violent crime problem in the 80s and 90s that began dropping throughout the 90s and has stayed low. The late Kevin Drum made a strong case that this drop was due to countries getting lead out of their environments, mainly by phasing out leaded gasoline. That sharp drop in crime is a story the MSM has deliberately ignored. For example the number of murders in NYC last year was 377; in 1990 there were 2, 245 murder and the population was less than it is today yet the mainstream media gives the impression that NYC is a crime ridden city. They also conveniently overlook the higher crime rates in red state cities and rural areas.
The media spent last year hyping any negative economic news and ignoring or downplaying the fact that inflation in the US was returning to normal levels, we had strong growth, the best job market in over 50 year, record employment for African American men, and wages rising faster than inflation with the greatest gains going to the lowest income levels. Not bad for an old senile president. A solid majority of swing voters who went for Trump told pollsters that they believed the national economy was bad/in a recession. They also told pollsters that they and their regions were doing well economically. Our founding fathers knew that a democracy requires well informed voters. The media doesn’t seem to see that as their responsibility despite the fact the Founders gave them special constitutional protection. They seem to believe their job is to cater to the feelings of the “real Americans” in MAGA land.
I agree with that.
I think Moran's opinion is absolutely borne out by the content of Stephen Miller's tweets and therefore constitutes factual reporting. As I said above, I agree with Margaret on the principle but think that this particular case is not the hill to die on.
Moran spoke the truth. We constantly hear the lies in the Wall Street Journal and the New York Post & on Fox ‘news.’ I prefer honest reporting. I’ll make up my mind. It’s time to shock the right with the truth. It appears ABC feels somewhat the same because they did not fire him. Funny, the bully always says it’s ’ not nice.’ I recognize your journalistic concern. But we are at war here. Do you want ABC to mince words on what’s happening in LA?
Does anyone remember how Hitler rose to power ? Does anyone care ? The freedom of the press, meaning the owners of the papers , did not let their journalists/ employees speak freely.
I basically agree with Noah Berlatsky- the road to fascism is paved with “objectivity”: https://www.publicnotice.co/p/abc-terry-moran-stephen-miller
Moran does not deserve a reprimand. I appreciate old school reporting objectivity, but I'm more offended by reporters plainly ignoring the facts of character, which are clear in both Miller and Trump.
I despise Rupert Murdoch and the damage he has done to the accountability of the media and journalism. Because of him and President Reagan there are no consequences for lying to the public and therefore we get agenda-driven “news”. He is directly responsible for the nightmare of Donald Trump and the misinformation he spews from Fox and other networks! Murdoch can go straight to hell!
This is what’s wrong with the democrats. We’re too nice! Moran did a great job handling that fool we are forced to call our president. He’s a straight shooter without a gun. Why is he being punished! Disgusting 🤢
Silly me, I always thought journalism was about truth and integrity, and THANK YOU Terry Moran for having the courage to display both. His comments about Stephen Miller can be supported by facts and evidence, unlike Millers opinions about immigrants and people of color. Media needs to follow his example, but of course won’t, better to let the current state of affairs to continue to metastasize.